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vanilla_gorilla
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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 1:35am - #51441 
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Supercharger vs Turbocharger

Hello everyone. I am a new member and the future owner of a '00 GTS. I was wondering what everyone's opinion is as to which is better, a supercharger or a turbocharger?

From what I understand, a turbo will produce more power, but is harder on the engine. I will want to keep my car running well for a long time, so that is an important factor.
Also, I have been told that a s/c makes a constant whining noise that is very irritable to some. I don't think I have ever heard one, so I have no idea what they're talikng about. I obviously want power gains, I read that the XS turbo kit will contribute to a total of 250hp for the GTS. Everyone's help is much appreciated.

I would also like to know what RPM ranges each will kick in. I would like to have the option to be able drive around without ever engaing the boost until I want to. Thanks again.

vanilla_gorilla
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4skin
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4skin Oct 6, 1:50am - #51442 

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Do a search on your topic its been discussed before.
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vanilla_gorilla
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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 1:55am - #51443 
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OK thumbsup
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XxMerlinxX Oct 6, 2:42am - #51444 
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Don't worry about it. A supercharger gives you constant boost whenever you want it. You hit the gas, it's there. With a turbocharger, however, you have to wait until the turbo itself spools up. On a little turbo it kicks in around 4k rpm. A big turbo at like 5k. Right now I only know of 2 supercharger kits. One by Blitz and the other by Trial. Trial's is $8000 so, better save up. And there are also more turbo kits out for GT's than GTS's, so take that into consideration also. If you have any more questions, just post up and one of us will answer.

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IcEd blUe
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IcEd blUe Oct 6, 2:43am - #51445 

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turbocharger is better, the one for the gts gives more hp then the blitz supercharger which only gives 27hp

also the turbo is not on all the time so its less strain on your engine
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vanilla_gorilla
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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 2:48am - #51446 
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I have heard that without the proper components, a turbo will damage your engine. Should I worry about this?

I also was thinking that if I am going to get a turbo, maybe I should save some money up front and buy a GT. I would not be happy about losing the 6 speed, but it seems that a turbo or superchared GT would be just as good as a GTS.

Lastly, what are the effects of either booster on the lift of a GTS? Will it be effected at all?

Thanks alot. smile
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Steven Oct 6, 2:49am - #51447 
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I disagree, because the turbo may not be spooled at lower RPMS but the peak HP and TQ is much higher than the peak S/c numbers. On the other hand, the s/c doesn't have a peak top end like the turbo but a broad power curve with added hp and tq at lower rpms where a turbo would be spooling.

Originally Posted by IcEd blUe
turbocharger is better, the one for the gts gives more hp then the blitz supercharger which only gives 27hp

also the turbo is not on all the time so its less strain on your engine
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IcEd blUe
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IcEd blUe Oct 6, 2:51am - #51448 

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Originally Posted by vanilla_gorilla
I have heard that without the proper components, a turbo will damage your engine. Should I worry about this?

I also was thinking that if I am going to get a turbo, maybe I should save some money up front and buy a GT. I would not be happy about losing the 6 speed, but it seems that a turbo or superchared GT would be just as good as a GTS.

Lastly, what are the effects of either booster on the lift of a GTS? Will it be effected at all?

Thanks alot. smile


deffinetly get a gt, you can get a turbo as cheap as 3100 that will put you to 250hp!!! thats 70hp more than a stock gts!!
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vanilla_gorilla
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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 3:02am - #51449 
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What about cams? I heard that it is necessary to replace the camshafts as well as other components to assure the longevity of the motor.
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glitch Oct 6, 3:11am - #51450 
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Originally Posted by vanilla_gorilla
What about cams? I heard that it is necessary to replace the camshafts as well as other components to assure the longevity of the motor.


don't really have to replace the camshafts unless you wanna change the behavior of your engine. it is advisable to replace the pistons and rods with reinforced ones if you'r running any kind of boost.

as far as superchargers and turbochargers, keep in mind that superchargers run off the engines power just like the alternator, so some consider it to have a parasitic effect on the engine and less efficient than a turbocharger. however constant boost throughout the rpm range is a definite plus from a supercharger. i prefer turbos tho since you can buy a blow off valve and have your car make that pssshshhhhhhh!!! sound whenever you shift rofl

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isaac Oct 6, 3:14am - #51451 
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From...
https://www.celicahobby.com/ubbthreads/thread.f_57266_0_collapsed_2__1.html

Located at...
https://www.celicahobby.com/feature/index.shtml
...


Whats the difference between a Super Charger & a Turbo Charger? First you must know the definition of "forced induction"...

FORCED INDUCTION

"Forced Induction" is the process of using a mechanical system to "force" more air into an engine. This includes Superchargers, Turbochargers, Nitrious systems, and other mechanical systems, but not Hood scoops which just direct outside air into the engine. Both Superchargers and Turbos use a compressor to "force" air into the engine, making it more dense (i.e. more oxygen). When a proportionately larger amount of fuel is added to the denser air charge, the mixture creates a much larger explosion and thus more power from the engine. Nitrous Oxide Systems ("NOS") works by directly injecting Nitrous Oxide (NO2) into the engine. The higher concentration of oxygen found in NO2 (compared to air) and more fuel leads to the same effect as Superchargers and Turbos. Although the basic concepts are similar, each differs in their design and execution.

...

SUPERCHARGERS

A supercharger is a compressor driven by a belt attached to the engine's crankshaft. Since they are powered directly by the crankshaft, they are actually a parasitic loss and actually rob horsepower to drive the compressor. However, as they are directly attached to the crankshaft, the extra power is available at all RPMs and there is no "lag" in the power delivery. There are two basic types of Superchargers, Positive Displacement and Centrifugal. Positive Displacement Superchargers fill a chamber of a fixed volume with air at atmospheric pressure nd move that air to the high pressure side. These superchargers generally provide a flat torque curve boost throughout the RPM range but are generally less efficient and thus produce less peak power. The most common Positive Displacement Supercharger is the "Roots" Supercharger and is used by most factory setups and Jackson Racing. A Roots Supercharger has two rotating, intermeshing lobes that pump air simply by trapping it on one side of the supercharger between the lobes and the supercharger housing and moving it to the other side of the supercharger. The main advantage of a Roots Supercharger is that there is immediate and proportional response to the throttle, because the blower is always spinning and its pumping ability increases proportionately and linearly with engine speed. Therefore, a Roots Supercharger makes the most low RPM power of any Forced Induction system.

A Centrifugal Supercharger (such as Vortech) is basically the compressor section of a turbocharger, but driven by the crankshaft through a step-up gearbox. Centrifugal superchargers often work best over a very small RPM range but provide higher peak power than Roots superchargers. Unfortunately, the power delivery of the boost increases non-linearly with engine speed meaning that they generate tremendous peak outputs, but at unuseably high RPMs. Nevertheless, they are popular with muscle car owners, who have plenty of low end Torque but need high RPM horsepower.

Superchargers can be placed between the throttle body of the carburetor or fuel injection system and the manifold; or at the air inlet before the throttle body. Racing cars usually have it located between the throttle body and the manifold. This design has the advantage that the fuel can be supplied through the throttle body without modification to any part of the system. If the supercharger is placed in front of the throttle body, fuel must be supplied under sufficient pressure to overcome the added air pressure created by the supercharger. The advantage of a supercharger over a turbocharger is that there is no lag time of boost; the moment the accelerator pedal is depressed, the boost is increased.

** Advantages: Instant power delivery
** Disadvantages: Parasitic power loss to system (less peak power)
** Applications: Recommended for low RPM, high torque applications (i.e. V8s)

...

TURBOCHARGERS

A turbocharger uses a turbine that is driven by the hot, expanding exhaust system stream to power a centrifugal compressor which forces air into the engine. Because a turbo is actually driven by wasted energy, there is no loss from the engine to power the turbo. However, because the system is run off the exhaust, it may take some time before the exhaust level builds up to a sufficient level to run the turbo charger. This delay in power delivery is called "Turbo Lag" and can lead to a significant pause between stepping on the gas and the feel of additional power. Furthermore, turbos often require cool down periods after use (meaning you have to let the car idle for a few minutes (!) everytime you want to shut the engine off, or else reduce the life of your turbo-charger, which only last 7-10 years anyway. More modern turbo charger designs have allowed turbos to slowly spin down even after the engine has been shut off and are more durable than older designs.

Most turbos use intercoolers, wastegates and compressor bypass valves (blow off valves) to help provide more useable power. An intercooler is a heat exchanger that is used to cool the air heated by the turbocharger's compressor. Therefore, the intercooler can significantly boost power because the cooler air it provides is more dense than the hot air straight out of the turbo. An intercooler also takes thermal load off of the engine by cooling the Intake air. A wastegate is designed to regulate boost pressure, and is simply a valve in the exhaust system that allows some of the exhaust to bypass the the turbo when it is not needed. The Bypass valve is a valve between the throttle and the turbo that vents extra boost pressure. When this valve vents to the outside air, it is called a blow off valve, and when it vents back into the inlet of the turbo, it is called a compressor bypass valve.

A turbocharged engine's compression ratio must be lowered by using a lower compression piston, since an excessive amount of pressure will wear on the piston, connecting rods, and crankshaft, and destroy the engine. All of these parts then, as well as the transmission, must be strengthened on a turbocharged engine or it will be torn apart by the increased horsepower.

** Advantages: Greater peak power
** Disadvantages: Lag in power delivery, long-term durability, cold-start emissions
** Applications: Recommended for high RPM applications (i.e. I4s)

Copyright 2002 Musclecarclub.com

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vanilla_gorilla
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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 3:20am - #51452 
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Glitch,
Do you know the effects of a turbo or supercharger on the lift of a GTS?
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glitch
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glitch Oct 6, 3:24am - #51453 
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Originally Posted by vanilla_gorilla
Glitch,
Do you know the effects of a turbo or supercharger on the lift of a GTS?


not really, but my guess would be with proper tuning it would improve lift by alot. then again i don't really know tho because i've heard about some integras that had to disable vtec when they were running turbo. i think it has something to do with too much air for the air/fuel mixture. it also depends on how much boost you are gonna be running. 4-5 psi like the amount that the GTS supercharger runs won't effect lift in a bad way thumbsup

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vanilla_gorilla
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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 3:24am - #51454 
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vanilla_gorilla
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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 3:30am - #51455 
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I had read all of this earlier, and it seems that a turbo would be the better choice. My big concern, though is having to replace thins like pistons, rods, and cams. I would like to not hae to do any of that, mainly for cost sake. If my turbo kit costs $3500, how much dough do you think would be required to upgrade the other stuff? Remember, I want a lot of life out of this thing.
Thanks
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glitch
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glitch Oct 6, 3:48am - #51456 
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i think to upgrade all that other stuff it would cost you another 3500. that's just an estimate tho.

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XxMerlinxX Oct 6, 4:08am - #51457 
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I would say more like another $2000. For good performance aftermarket rods and pistons, it'll only cost you around $1000-$1200 dollars. Throw in another $800 just to have some wiggle room.

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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 4:15am - #51458 
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So basically, for 5-6 grand I can install a turbo kit with everything I will need to keep the engine running strong, right?

Now, I need everyone's opinion: which is better and why: a turbocharged gt or a turbocharged gts? If anyone has hp/tq numbers from either that would be cool too. Thanks
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spaztikid Oct 6, 4:34am - #51459 
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turbo gt because it has lower compression.

trubo gts cause just imagine lift.
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vanilla_gorilla
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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 4:45am - #51460 
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Originally Posted by spaztikid
turbo gt because it has lower compression.

trubo gts cause just imagine lift.



What exactly do you mean about the lift? Are you saying how much better it will be?
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spaztikid Oct 6, 4:47am - #51461 
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in a gts you hit lift at 6k rpm...the valves lift and there;s a boost in HP that puts you into your seat. it would be tight to feel lift and turbo at the same time.
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vanilla_gorilla Oct 6, 5:17am - #51462 
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Rock on! So you don't think there will be a problem with lift and turbo going at the same time? Cause that's really wht I want to do! goodjob
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glitch Oct 6, 5:52am - #51463 
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i think it depends on how much you are going to boost.

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