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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 15
MaBaBaY
Member
MaBaBaY Aug 6, 4:41pm - #242091 
2002 Silver ToYoTa Celica
Member
2002 ToYoTa Celica

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 15
CA
Just Removed Butterfly

yea i just removed my butterfly i'm at work so i just took 10 min off and did it engine sounds a lot deeper now and a lil faster it's the best free mod ever YEA!

RECOMMENeD EVERY1 TO DO IT

just go to the intalls page and the directions are easy as hell took me 10 min to do

and yes i am a n00b at this shit so i'm glad :smile:
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,454
Elec-FuYu
Specialist
Elec-FuYu Aug 6, 4:47pm - #242092 
2003 Silver Toyota Celica
Specialist
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,454
B.C. Coquitlam
that's rite~! thumbsup that's ur first step thumbsup

there's still a lota things awaiting you! grin grin Intake next!

now a Intake and butterfly is a day and night difference

I am a HID Maniac!!
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
DiabloGTS
Wheezy Joe
DiabloGTS Aug 6, 4:52pm - #242093 

Wheezy Joe
2002 Kawasaki Ninja 250

Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
Lafayette, LA
Be careful when doing this, because you lose vacuum pressure at idle, and if you have ABS, when you brake in a panic situation, it will cause your car to stall out because it won't be able to maintain idle speed and power assist the ABS with the lessened vacuum pressure

To have played and laughed with enthusiasm
and sung with exultation
To know even one life has breathed easier
This is to have succeeded.
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
RevMonster
Masta OC
RevMonster Aug 6, 4:54pm - #242094 

Masta OC
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
Orange County, Ca
^^^ meh. if you worry about that sort of trivial thing, next you'll be wearing a seatbelt too.

I'm just a crosshair
I'm just a shot away from you
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
DiabloGTS
Wheezy Joe
DiabloGTS Aug 6, 4:56pm - #242095 

Wheezy Joe
2002 Kawasaki Ninja 250

Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
Lafayette, LA
I worry about it, because having your car stall out during a panic stop means you lose steering AND braking.

Doesn't sound like the kinda thing I'd want to have happen to me in the snow, or in the rain when I need to control the car in a skid spineyes

To have played and laughed with enthusiasm
and sung with exultation
To know even one life has breathed easier
This is to have succeeded.
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
RevMonster
Masta OC
RevMonster Aug 6, 4:59pm - #242096 

Masta OC
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
Orange County, Ca
I remember that you yanked your butterfly a while back. Did you put it back in?

I'm just a crosshair
I'm just a shot away from you
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
DiabloGTS
Wheezy Joe
DiabloGTS Aug 6, 5:01pm - #242097 

Wheezy Joe
2002 Kawasaki Ninja 250

Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
Lafayette, LA
yep, the second I stalled the car out from doing a really hard stop from 90 into a 15 mph blind curve.

Almost crashed the car, put the butterfly back in once I got home.

To have played and laughed with enthusiasm
and sung with exultation
To know even one life has breathed easier
This is to have succeeded.
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 15
MaBaBaY
Member
MaBaBaY Aug 6, 5:08pm - #242098 
2002 Silver ToYoTa Celica
Member
2002 ToYoTa Celica

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 15
CA
i have a auto will i still stall ??

damn you guys got me scared now
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,139
ct
C'mon & hit me!
ct Aug 6, 5:08pm - #242099 

C'mon & hit me!
2000 Toyota Celica GTS

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,139
Woodland Hills, CA
this mod is dum thumbsdown...get an Intake. rofl

al kidding aside i have dynos that show the gains as minimal...we're talkin like .4-.7whp...at lift. i doubt a gt gets any at all. that butterfly is there for a reason.

Originally posted by SKOOF:
yoru such a clown, i wish you lived in nyc, i would love to just give you the beating that youve probably never gotten in your life.
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
RevMonster
Masta OC
RevMonster Aug 6, 5:08pm - #242100 

Masta OC
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
Orange County, Ca
eek ack.

note to self: be careful with DIY mods

I'm just a crosshair
I'm just a shot away from you
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
DiabloGTS
Wheezy Joe
DiabloGTS Aug 6, 5:11pm - #242101 

Wheezy Joe
2002 Kawasaki Ninja 250

Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
Lafayette, LA
it's only a big deal when you brake hard, and put the clutch in to change gears. the car drops to idle speed, and since the butterfly valve would then engage, and create more vacuum pressure, it can't maintain that level of idle, and it stalls

if you have an auto, don't worry about it because you are never going to change gears with a clutch spineyes

To have played and laughed with enthusiasm
and sung with exultation
To know even one life has breathed easier
This is to have succeeded.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,982
Zero
Furi Kuri
Zero Aug 6, 5:41pm - #242102 

Furi Kuri
2002 Toyota Celica GT

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,982
San Diego, CA
haha, so its a better DIY for auto...in terms of stalling out. wave

I've mastered the art of the After Image Technique.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,454
Elec-FuYu
Specialist
Elec-FuYu Aug 6, 5:59pm - #242103 
2003 Silver Toyota Celica
Specialist
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,454
B.C. Coquitlam
well...dont you step on clutch when you at a panic stop?

if that so, how can ur car be stalling? or is it possible to stall with the clutch in at taht situation also?

I am a HID Maniac!!
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,672
ragingpaseo
Specialist
ragingpaseo Aug 6, 6:39pm - #242104 
2003 blue Toyota Celica
Specialist
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,672
towson, md
any Performance gain???
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,139
ct
C'mon & hit me!
ct Aug 6, 8:17pm - #242105 

C'mon & hit me!
2000 Toyota Celica GTS

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,139
Woodland Hills, CA
Originally Posted by ragingpaseo
any Performance gain???


here...6-sp gts. you can bet a GT 5sp or gts auto will not get the same gains.
1870157357-butterflymod.jpg

Originally posted by SKOOF:
yoru such a clown, i wish you lived in nyc, i would love to just give you the beating that youve probably never gotten in your life.
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 929
CID498
ECelica Staff
CID498 Aug 6, 10:47pm - #242106 

ECelica Staff
2000 Toyota Celica GT

Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 929
So.Cal
Originally Posted by DiabloGTS
Be careful when doing this, because you lose vacuum pressure at idle, and if you have ABS, when you brake in a panic situation, it will cause your car to stall out because it won't be able to maintain idle speed and power assist the ABS with the lessened vacuum pressure


Did You plug the vacuum line with a shunt? That would have eliminated the vacuum leak.

"They don't make no seatbelt for the mind. So I can't buckle up for this ride!"
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,899
Gen7fan
ThE iRoN mAiDeN
Gen7fan Aug 6, 10:57pm - #242107 
2003 silver streak Toyota Celica GT
ThE iRoN mAiDeN
2003 Toyota Celica GT

Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,899
Maryland
This mod is masturbation, leave it at a drop in filter (K&N or TRD) or get a aftermarket Intake. Not worth killing yourself just to say you have a mod. thumbsdown
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,016
Haulin_A_Doo
Specialist
Haulin_A_Doo Aug 7, 12:07am - #242108 
Specialist

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,016
Ontario
Originally Posted by ct
Originally Posted by ragingpaseo
any Performance gain???


here...6-sp gts. you can bet a GT 5sp or gts auto will not get the same gains.


The GTS Auto & the GTS 6-sp would have EXACTLY the same gain because they are the same engine. Gearing does not determine horsepower, the motor does. You are measuring a dyno in a single gear, not the quarter mile.
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,003
Sancho
SD Syndicate
Sancho Aug 7, 5:39am - #242109 

SD Syndicate
2004 Toyota Celica GT

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,003
San Diego, CA
Its a great n00b mod, for those really getting into car modifications. I don't feel like buying a Performance filter because i'll probably be getting a CAI next. For those who don't have exhuast, Intake, or headers and want a more deeper sound than stock, this is still the ticket. thumbsup

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2004 Toyota Celica GT
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Posts: 2,030
RevMonster
Masta OC
RevMonster Aug 7, 5:43am - #242110 

Masta OC
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
Orange County, Ca
Quote:


The GTS Auto & the GTS 6-sp would have EXACTLY the same gain because they are the same engine. Gearing does not determine horsepower, the motor does. You are measuring a dyno in a single gear, not the quarter mile.


ACTUALLY... grin

The drivetrain loss is different. People have posted auto GTS dyno's before, and they are substantially less than 6-speeds. (my celi is auto, btw).

I'm just a crosshair
I'm just a shot away from you
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 528
renfield90
Senior Member
renfield90 Aug 7, 5:53am - #242111 

Senior Member
2001 Toyota Celica GT

Joined: May 2004
Posts: 528
Tempe, AZ
^^ how do you dyno an auto?

anyway, I agree with Sancho. I pulled mine out for the sound, and if you've never done mods on a car before but want to start, it's a good way to get your feet wet.
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
RevMonster
Masta OC
RevMonster Aug 7, 6:06am - #242112 

Masta OC
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
Orange County, Ca
Originally Posted by renfield90
^^ how do you dyno an auto?

anyway, I agree with Sancho. I pulled mine out for the sound, and if you've never done mods on a car before but want to start, it's a good way to get your feet wet.


Same way they dyno the 900 HP auto Supras grin

I'm just a crosshair
I'm just a shot away from you
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,016
Haulin_A_Doo
Specialist
Haulin_A_Doo Aug 7, 6:53am - #242113 
Specialist

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,016
Ontario
Quote:


The GTS Auto & the GTS 6-sp would have EXACTLY the same gain because they are the same engine. Gearing does not determine horsepower, the motor does. You are measuring a dyno in a single gear, not the quarter mile.


ACTUALLY... grin

The drivetrain loss is different. People have posted auto GTS dyno's before, and they are substantially less than 6-speeds. (my celi is auto, btw). [/quote]

Ya, but the drivetrain loss is a constant. The gain would not change.
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
RevMonster
Masta OC
RevMonster Aug 7, 7:15am - #242114 

Masta OC
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
Orange County, Ca
...but isn't drivetrain loss expressed as a percentage of total HP, not a constant number?

Sorry, could be wrong on this one...

I'm just a crosshair
I'm just a shot away from you
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,016
Haulin_A_Doo
Specialist
Haulin_A_Doo Aug 7, 7:22am - #242115 
Specialist

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,016
Ontario
Originally Posted by RevMonster
...but isn't drivetrain loss expressed as a percentage of total HP, not a constant number? Sorry, could be wrong on this one...


I don't know. Okay 180HP flywheel less 20HP = 160HP ground
Is it: 1) Turbo to 240HP flywheel less 30HP = 210HP ground
Or: 2) Turbo to 240HP flywheel less 20HP = 220HP ground

Either way, I guess its symantecs considering we are talking about a 0.7HP gain.
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
RevMonster
Masta OC
RevMonster Aug 7, 7:24am - #242116 

Masta OC
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
Orange County, Ca
Yeah, I think it's a ratio of the total HP produced... so your net HP loss in the drive train increases with Performance mods.

But you are right... we're arguing about .1 HP difference (or less) either way. I just like being right. laughsilly

I'm just a crosshair
I'm just a shot away from you
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,016
Haulin_A_Doo
Specialist
Haulin_A_Doo Aug 7, 7:27am - #242117 
Specialist

Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,016
Ontario
I wonder how many dynos it would take to prove the 0.1HP?
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RevMonster
Masta OC
RevMonster Aug 7, 7:29am - #242118 

Masta OC
2003 Toyota Celica

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,030
Orange County, Ca
I'm pretty sure that's well within the margin of error.

I guess you could dyno a 6-speed with the mod 10 times and average out the gain... then an auto 10 times and average it out. Still, I don't think anyone here has that much free time on their hands. rofl

I'm just a crosshair
I'm just a shot away from you
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Posts: 3,077
slidr
Specialist
slidr Aug 7, 7:17pm - #242119 

Specialist
2000 Toyota Celica

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,077
Saint Louis, MO
This is a stupid mod.

If you feel any difference in power, then please buy a $50 chip off of me to boost your flywheel horsepower by 50 BHP!

The dyno for this mod says it gives a gain of 1hp. Whoopie! You can't even feel 1hp. The same effect can be felt when you are low on gas, or you take your bookbag out of the trunk of your car.

Also, let it be known that a gain of 1hp is not even really a gain most of the time because the margain of error on a dynometer can ofter be a few horsepower.

Aqua Teen Hunger Force...number one in the hood, G
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Posts: 874
drkramm
seabass
drkramm Aug 7, 7:35pm - #242120 
2000 black Toyota Celica GTS
seabass
2000 Toyota Celica GTS

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 874
pa
Originally Posted by DiabloGTS
I worry about it, because having your car stall out during a panic stop means you lose steering AND braking.

Doesn't sound like the kinda thing I'd want to have happen to me in the snow, or in the rain when I need to control the car in a skid spineyes


make sure your clear on this you loose abs and power steering not steering all togeather

if i can wrestle a 5k pound ramcharger with 33's on it to a controled stop with no power the celica should be a cake walk

hey thats a 20 minute phone call
"if i have seen farther it is by standing on the shoulders of giants"
derek: do you know that non dairy cream is flamable
Jennie: ...derek..what did you do
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
DiabloGTS
Wheezy Joe
DiabloGTS Aug 7, 7:43pm - #242121 

Wheezy Joe
2002 Kawasaki Ninja 250

Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,451
Lafayette, LA
CID, plugging the tube isn't what goes wrong.

The engine runs out of air, because the valve closes at idle, making the air come in at a higher velocity.

To have played and laughed with enthusiasm
and sung with exultation
To know even one life has breathed easier
This is to have succeeded.
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,408
CelicaRacer05
Specialist
CelicaRacer05 Aug 8, 12:59am - #242122 

Specialist
2000 Toyota Celica GT

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,408
Englewood, CO
Originally Posted by Gen7fan
This mod is masturbation, leave it at a drop in filter (K&N or TRD) or get a aftermarket Intake. Not worth killing yourself just to say you have a mod. thumbsdown


i got the TRD Performance Intake filter, but when i was doing the install i decided to take out the butterfly too... shouldnt the guys who have taken it out with there CAI's have problems too?? with braking??
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 433
ArumnDark
Senior Member
ArumnDark Aug 8, 6:52am - #242123 
2004 Silver Streak Toyota Celica
Senior Member
2004 Toyota Celica

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 433
Independence, California
Taking out the butterfly is more of a sound thing than a Performance thing...

I took my butterfly out (about 1-2 weeks before my CAI went in smile ), and I didn't have any trouble at all. But I've yet to be in a situation where my ABS needed to kick on (in the Celi, that is!).

[Linked Image]
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,139
ct
C'mon & hit me!
ct Aug 9, 2:20pm - #242124 

C'mon & hit me!
2000 Toyota Celica GTS

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,139
Woodland Hills, CA
too much thought went into this thread... thumbsdown rofl

Originally posted by SKOOF:
yoru such a clown, i wish you lived in nyc, i would love to just give you the beating that youve probably never gotten in your life.
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 116
mxsuperfly25
Adrenaline
mxsuperfly25 Aug 9, 5:44pm - #242125 
2000 Black Toyota Celica
Adrenaline
2000 Toyota Celica

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 116
PA
Originally Posted by CelicaRacer05
Originally Posted by Gen7fan
This mod is masturbation, leave it at a drop in filter (K&N or TRD) or get a aftermarket Intake. Not worth killing yourself just to say you have a mod. thumbsdown


i got the trd Performance Intake filter, but when i was doing the install i decided to take out the butterfly too... shouldnt the guys who have taken it out with there CAI's have problems too?? with braking??


i'm in the same boat as you, with a CAI they ditch the whole airbox, but would you still have this problem?
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