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TheSpaz
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TheSpaz Jul 2, 10:18pm - #214708 

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2004 Toyota Celica GT

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Alabama, USA
Low end torque upgrades

K. I need something for my 2k4 celi gt that will increase the get-up speed. ne ideas?
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ikin
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ikin Jul 2, 10:21pm - #214709 
2000 silver Toyota Celica GT
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california
AEM Intake is good for low end torque, Injen is good for higher rpm hp. i have Injen and would not get anything else then that, the dc header is pretty good, cant think of anythig else except a Turbo kit by sf.
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TheSpaz
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TheSpaz Jul 2, 10:22pm - #214710 

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what about an new exaust? ne low end help there?
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Tru_gts
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Tru_gts Jul 2, 10:24pm - #214711 
2002 Black Toyota Celica
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Frisco
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To my girl Truboo
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jrock
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jrock Jul 2, 10:44pm - #214712 
2004 black Toyota Celica
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2004 Toyota Celica

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us
corret me if im wrong pls, but doesn't Turbo have a delay which would work against low end torque; does a supercharger have a delay? confused
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TheSpaz
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TheSpaz Jul 2, 10:54pm - #214713 

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2004 Toyota Celica GT

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yeah thats what i thought too, but it doesn't matter anyway, a Turbo is too rich for my blood right now
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CelicaGTizzle
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CelicaGTizzle Jul 2, 10:56pm - #214714 

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2001 Toyota Celica GT

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DA sports claims their Turbo starts kicking in at about 2200 rpms. So, isn't too much lag.

My car is gunna be 10x faster than yours...haha... I'm gunna buy like 10
of those speedchips! I figure if 1 gets me 20hp then 10 will get me 200hp!
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csheriff
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csheriff Jul 2, 10:57pm - #214715 
2002 Red Toyota Celica
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yeah, Turbos have waiting time for the spool up, depending on the size of the wastegate. superchargers are instant power, although they are parasitic, where a Turbo is free power.

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ravertony
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ravertony Jul 2, 11:01pm - #214716 
2002 Super White Toyota Celica
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dont exhausts take away low end power.. because they decrease back pressure they lower your low end but increase your high end which makes up for it but you want low end so an exhaust would be a mistake unless you get one that has a good low end design confused
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 2, 11:25pm - #214717 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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SoCal
Exhausts take away low end torque, but "back pressure" is a myth. Rather, the effect is called "gas scavenging." Because, your exhaust pulls air through the engine because the gas molecules latch onto each other. Back pressure is where the gas can't go fast enough, making air go through the engine slower. BACK PRESSURE IS ALWAYS BAD. Rather, the reason you don't go too large of an exhaust is so there remains an enclosed area for gas molecules to scavenge within- if you have no exhaust on there they instantly spread out.

F-1 race cars have no exhaust, and are set up so that gas scavenging still takes place. In theory, the largest exhaust is better; but no engines not F1 will work without gas scavenging smile
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QTRMLR_1
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QTRMLR_1 Jul 3, 7:31am - #214718 

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a nitrous kit will give you low end power, hehe.

I get my kicks on EC.
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spaztikid
dikitzaps
spaztikid Jul 3, 7:32am - #214719 
dikitzaps
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wtf... nice screen name
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QTRMLR_1
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QTRMLR_1 Jul 3, 8:03am - #214720 

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2002 Toyota Celica

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Los Angeles, CA
a lightweight flywheel will definitely increase the "getup" speed. It's nice b/c it's one of those upgrades where the dealership can't see you did anything to your new car under warranty. you can also always dismantle that nitrous kit if you need any repairs done by the dealership. but you should at least do the exhaust before nitrous for Performance and the safety of your engine. a restrictive exhaust can cause detonation when used with nitrous. don't forget to go to colder plugs on the nitrous and use higher octane gas, plus an octane booster to be safe. other ideas are a grounding kit, much lighter than stock rims, pulleys, full synthetic motor oil...
also about the exhausts...you can wait for Apexi to come out with their variable valve muffler, the PS Revolution. it'll be closed at low rpms to give you good "gas scavenging", then it will open up at higher rpms to let the higher speed gas out to minimize back-pressure. Supposedly it's also quieter than some b/c the closed valve acts like a silencer, if you care about sound. I called Apexi and they said August at the earliest.

i've driven both a gt and gts in their stock conditions and the gt has more low end feel. My first upgrades on my GTS were the clutch out of necessity and a flywheel by option, and I have to say after that, the GTS with flywheel has more low end "feel" than the stock gt, a lot more. stock clutches are weak and can't take abuse, so you see I could of had the dealership put a new one in, but I didn't want to go back a couple of months later for a new one. if you want recommendation on a clutch, I love my Cluthmasters stage 3 kevlar. It's smooth yet grips instantly. hey, it's a bullet-proof clutch, and handles drop clutch starts very well, as long as you break it in slowly before putting it to the test. btw, a better clutch will give you more torque off the line.

I get my kicks on EC.
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 3, 9:18am - #214721 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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1997 Toyota Celica GT

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SoCal
A lightweight fly wheel is pretty controversal. You have to decide on how "light" you want it to go. Too light, and it's UNDRIVEABLE in traffic conditions. Too heavy, and its no better than stock.

It's one of those upgrades that REALLY effects how drivable your car is- even if you modify it just a little.

It's not so much of a lower end torque increase, as a lightweight flywheel will uhm.. lol, PROPELL you through your RPMs a lot faster- so you spend much less time in the lower RPMs
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Jae
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Jae Jul 3, 11:21am - #214722 

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palm springs, burbank CA
i believe anything such as Intake, header, exhaust wont give you low-end torque. but it gives you top-end power, which makes up for the low-end. some cases the i/h/e will make you loose low-end torque but have high gain at the top.
S/c will give you good low-end torque, if you have the money. But even though Turbo sucks at low-end, the top-end makes up the lag. After 1st gear, you are not going to have any lag from Turbo.
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slidr
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slidr Jul 3, 4:33pm - #214723 

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2000 Toyota Celica

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Saint Louis, MO
Bottom Line:

The Celica has less than adequate low end torque. That's to be expected with a car that has such a long powerband.

Any mod such as Intake, headers, or exhaust will free up not only horsepower, but also torque. Instead of worrying about torque, you should be worrying about more horsepower also. There is no magic mod (except perhaps an aftermarket torque converter for an AT) that will just free up torque.

Most but not all mods will free up both horsepower and torque by making the load induced upon the engine/drivetrain relatively easier, but no mod will provide any maricle results.

Aqua Teen Hunger Force...number one in the hood, G
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RyCeCuBe
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RyCeCuBe Jul 3, 4:42pm - #214724 

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LA 626 area
yea i'd rather perfect hp and top end because that's where u'll need it most for highways and racing. torquey cars just kill gas anyway. wave

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QTRMLR_1
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QTRMLR_1 Jul 4, 3:27am - #214725 

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2002 Toyota Celica

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hey, shidarin, I've seen the weights of flywheels for the celica and none seem excessively lightweight, just about the same as my clutchmasters, and I have no trouble driving around in LA traffic. he wants more "getup" on the low end, and that'll definitely give it to him. guys can do 2.1x launches with lightweight flywheels so it's not much of an issue there either.

I get my kicks on EC.
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 4, 4:04am - #214726 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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QTMLR, than it's my bad. Some of the lightweight flywheels available for my generation celica are so light and quick off the line that they're impossible to drive in less than 30 mph traffic, I find it hard to believe similiar ones aren't available for the 7th gen.
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oas
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oas Jul 4, 4:09am - #214727 
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way you so obsest with the low end power???
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QTRMLR_1
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QTRMLR_1 Jul 4, 5:00am - #214728 

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low end power is good on the street when taking someone from a roll at low rpms...and also good for auto-x and road racing where you aren't always in the high rpms like drag racing.

confused RyCe, how is top end good for highways? when I'm on the highway I'm always around 3k rpms, except for that one time racing and beating that older mr2 at 130 mph hehe.

I get my kicks on EC.
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 4, 5:11am - #214729 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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top end is good for highways, because if you want power, you'll downshift and stick to the higher rpms.
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QTRMLR_1
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QTRMLR_1 Jul 4, 5:15am - #214730 

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ahhh, downshifting, good point. I try not to do that too much even with my upgraded clutch.

I get my kicks on EC.
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 4, 5:20am - #214731 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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.. Then how do you accelerate? confused
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QTRMLR_1
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QTRMLR_1 Jul 4, 5:24am - #214732 

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on the freeway? I just add throttle...it still pulls pretty hard with my upgrades, even in 6th gear.

I get my kicks on EC.
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QTRMLR_1
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QTRMLR_1 Jul 4, 5:31am - #214733 

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where in socal are you shidarin? after you get your Turbo, wanna meet up?

I get my kicks on EC.
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 4, 5:33am - #214734 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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Orange County or Westchester QTR, sure I'll meet up, but it won't be for a couple months.
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QTRMLR_1
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QTRMLR_1 Jul 4, 5:51am - #214735 

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maybe we can get RyCe too...I'm near 626.

I get my kicks on EC.
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RyCeCuBe
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RyCeCuBe Jul 4, 6:02am - #214736 

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LA 626 area
sup...i saw 626 in there..and thanks shid for answering for me. hehehe downshift duh...juz jokin. grin

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oas
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oas Jul 4, 6:06am - #214737 
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Originally Posted by QTRMLR_1
low end power is good on the street when taking someone from a roll at low rpms...and also good for auto-x and road racing where you aren't always in the high rpms like drag racing.

confused RyCe, how is top end good for highways? when I'm on the highway I'm always around 3k rpms, except for that one time racing and beating that older mr2 at 130 mph hehe.


i under stand the twisted roads but highway its better do drop down a gear than try climbing from 3 or less rpm.
and auto x i dont know wath is but if it is the track wont you be at end of trac at red line?
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 4, 6:08am - #214738 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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SoCal
Woah, totally forgot to refute this

Quote:
Any mod such as Intake, headers, or exhaust will free up not only horsepower, but also torque.


This is the most untrue statement uttered so far in this thread. Too large of an exhaust will LOWER your torque hp- especially in the lower RPMs. Furthermore, all of those mods differ by brandname, or custom exhaust. Some brands add less hp at the expense of robbing less torque, etc etc etc. You 7th geners are lucky to actually HAVE name brand stuff for your cars.

The easiest kill any of you will ever have is to find an NA car with 3 inch piping. Easy pickings.
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oas
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oas Jul 4, 6:08am - #214739 
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Originally Posted by shidarin
Orange County or Westchester QTR, sure I'll meet up, but it won't be for a couple months.


wow saw that movie Orange County pretty funny low the brother hehehe
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 4, 6:12am - #214740 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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*sigh*
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slidr
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slidr Jul 4, 7:59am - #214741 

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2000 Toyota Celica

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Quote:
Any mod such as Intake, headers, or exhaust will free up not only horsepower, but also torque.


This is the most untrue statement uttered so far in this thread. Too large of an exhaust will LOWER your torque hp- especially in the lower RPMs. Furthermore, all of those mods differ by brandname, or custom exhaust. Some brands add less hp at the expense of robbing less torque, etc etc etc. You 7th geners are lucky to actually HAVE name brand stuff for your cars.

The easiest kill any of you will ever have is to find an NA car with 3 inch piping. Easy pickings. [/quote]You could have 10 inch piping on an axle back exhaust, and it wouldn't mean shit, nor would it rob you of power. You have to decrease backpressure a hell of a lot in order to lose horsepower. There is no way to gain low end torque without other losses/gains.


Aqua Teen Hunger Force...number one in the hood, G
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 4, 4:41pm - #214742 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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SoCal
slidr, go read my post comparing backpressing and gas scavenging. An exhaust is just like the size of a Turbo. The smaller it is (without being too small) the shorter the "spool up" time, or low end torque. The larger it is (as long as it's not too large) the more high end you have.
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TheSpaz
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TheSpaz Jul 5, 7:54pm - #214743 

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2004 Toyota Celica GT

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thank you all for the info on all this. i'll see what i can do and get back to ya. thx again. peace out.
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Lucky_317
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Lucky_317 Jul 7, 8:29pm - #214744 

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2000 Toyota Celica

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Fontana, CA
Originally Posted by QTRMLR_1
maybe we can get RyCe too...I'm near 626.


lemme know when this is goin on thumbsup

Best 60' 1.959 best 1/4 - 13.7 @ 101mph
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AZZKIKR
SHO - NUFF
AZZKIKR Jul 7, 8:46pm - #214745 

SHO - NUFF
2003 Toyota Celica GT

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ATL GA
if you want low end, you could have a custom stroker kit made for your car...or go 11:1 internals like I did...it helps (no bogging or anything...just strong the whole way through)
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 7, 9:18pm - #214746 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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1997 Toyota Celica GT

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SoCal
Yeah, I never mentioned it because I forgot you 7th geners have stroker kits for it; (on the 6th gen and stuff, this is hard stuff) but increasing your compression ratio is a great way to get more umph out of your car all through the power range.. Just dont go too high! and dont Turbo it afterwards.
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AZZKIKR
SHO - NUFF
AZZKIKR Jul 7, 9:39pm - #214747 

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2003 Toyota Celica GT

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ATL GA
Originally Posted by shidarin
Yeah, I never mentioned it because I forgot you 7th geners have stroker kits for it; (on the 6th gen and stuff, this is hard stuff) but increasing your compression ratio is a great way to get more umph out of your car all through the power range.. Just dont go too high! and dont Turbo it afterwards.
...yeah, I went 11:1 because I had FI on my last ride, and got in huge trouble...so the 11:1 keeps me away from that
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shidarin
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shidarin Jul 7, 9:44pm - #214748 
1997 Speeding Ticket Red Toyota Celica GT
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SoCal
(not to change the topic of the thread) how'd you get in huge trouble with the FI?
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AZZKIKR
SHO - NUFF
AZZKIKR Jul 7, 10:03pm - #214749 

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2003 Toyota Celica GT

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ATL GA
I had a 2000 dodge Dakota and Dumped about 7,500 into the engine and driveline (custom t3/t4 Turbo, new cam, 2.02" Intake valves, 1.65" exhaust valves, port and polish, custom throttle body, nos 125 shot plate system, 8.8:1 pistons...blah blah blah...)...disconnected the speed sensor from the rear diff. housing for the track , so no govenor...was at the track one day, and cracked the block cause I turned up the boost from 8 psi to 10 psi, and hit the Juice... and Boom...cruise to a halt, cry like hell, and call a cab to go home cry cry cry...so yeah...I've had my fill of F/I, and its great, but I can't handle the responsibility, and the loss of money if ANYTHING is off even a little thumbsdown thumbsdown...between that and excessive speeding tix (only two) because no one believed I had Turbo until they heard the BOV...so yeah, none of that anymore
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AZZKIKR
SHO - NUFF
AZZKIKR Jul 7, 10:05pm - #214750 

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2003 Toyota Celica GT

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ATL GA
^^^ besides, I like my 11:1 GT...its fun to drive, and pulls me when I need it...and its not uncontrollable like when boost kicks in, especially at track days at Road Atlanta thumbsup
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