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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 522
Rave669
Senior Member
Rave669 Jun 15, 7:36am - #21265 

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2002 Toyota Celica

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 522
Lisle, IL
Re: Port and polished?

I started this thread because it's namesake ( port and polished?? ) was locked. Why, I don't know. confused

First off, the link provided at the end of the thread refers to porting the exhaust manifold, not the cylinder head, which I think chris was asking about.

Scott, port and polish on the head will increase HP, and moreso than ANY Intake tube, if it's done right.

The head will flow more air in, and more exhaust out of the cylinders after porting. Oversized valves & springs would be a must to match the port job, but, there is a downside...

As many people on this board are more than happy to point out, there are virtually no sources out there for reprogramming our ECU's, this is a hurdle, since you need to tune the ECU to add more fuel across the RPM range and compensate for the increased flow. Also, your fuel economy will drop like a stone depending on how intense the porting is. one way around the ECU issue is to get an aftermarket AFC, and tune it on a dyno manually, but the warranty will be a dead parrot at that stage. However, the benefits could be pretty sizeable if everything is done by a competent machine shop and the fuel system is properly tuned. since the Celica uses a MAF sensor, air flow shouldn't require much tuning, as the MAF will pick up on the increased flow, but fuel mapping is critical since you'd be going beyond the specs of the ECU's pre-set thresholds.

the 2zzge VVTL-i motor is about as radical as one can get, head-wise, so you can't go oversize too much, as stock, the head is ported very well, and there isn't much room for improvement, but there is some wiggle room for die-hard tuners. as for the 1zz, there is more room for improvement. also remember, if the 2zz head flows like mad after porting, when it goes into lift, the motor may not be able to handle the added flow, unless of course, you take precautions.

On the 2zz, I'd lower the compression a little, and get new cams that retard the timing a bit, you don't want any detonation. lower compression is easy, just get a thicker head gasket (racing copper seal type) or swap the pistons for dished out ones.

On either app, you'll probably need new injectors (higher flow rate, possibly just blueprinted ones) and an external fuel pressure regulator.

Keep in mind, this is in no way is a set list of parts you need, there may be other elements that need replacing, such as connecting rods, oil/fuel pumps, swapping in anti-pump lifters. it depends on the setup, and what will be needed to compensate for the increased flow.

Just my two cents, Hope this helps grin


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Steven
ECelica Staff
Steven Jun 15, 7:45am - #21266 
2001 Spectra Blue Mica Toyota Celica GTS
ECelica Staff
2001 Toyota Celica GTS

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,295
Riverside, CA
Have you done all this? If not, why are yout telling us about this wonderful info, go out and do it and report to us the results!
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 522
Rave669
Senior Member
Rave669 Jun 15, 11:53pm - #21267 

Senior Member
2002 Toyota Celica

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 522
Lisle, IL
I have done all that to other motors before, mostly small-block chevys, works great. However, My GTS is brand new and is under warranty, not to mention the fact that I don't have $1000 bucks on hand to rebuild my cylinder head yet again.

Why am I saying all this? because someone asked a question regarding port and polish, and I was kind enough to give my input.

You could do it yourself, users on Newcelica.org have been there and done that already, so if you want more info, check there for yourself. Here are some of the relavent threads:

http://www.newcelica.org/forums/sho...readid=78063&highlight=cylinder+head

http://www.newcelica.org/forums/sho...readid=72812&highlight=cylinder+head

http://www.newcelica.org/forums/sho...readid=17585&highlight=cylinder+head

Gains are modest unless the fuel & timing is tuned to compensate for the increased flow, maybe 10-15 HP from a mild p&p without the extra effort to tune it.

Many companies have aftermarket valves, valvesprings, pistons & such, however, a source for new lifters ready to go might have to be sourced from japan.

If anyone has a spare 2ZZ cylinder head to send me, I would be more than happy to cart it off to WI to start rebuilding it this summer, but I'm not going to void my warranty just to appease you guys, sorry cry.

-Rave669

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Steven
ECelica Staff
Steven Jun 15, 11:55pm - #21268 
2001 Spectra Blue Mica Toyota Celica GTS
ECelica Staff
2001 Toyota Celica GTS

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,295
Riverside, CA
You have tried looking for a 2zz head at a junkyard right?

Also, how would you go about finding a reputable shop to handle such a project? I live in southern california, there are many shops that have done work on honda b series heads. Is it just a matter of experience?
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 522
Rave669
Senior Member
Rave669 Jun 16, 12:18am - #21269 

Senior Member
2002 Toyota Celica

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 522
Lisle, IL
yup, unfortunately, here in IL, the car is so new, I haven't had the luck to find one yet, but I'm still looking around in the event someone wrecks one.

As for the build-up, my Brother has several friends that have their own machine shop, they build all his motors & have a LOT of know how (they build all the motors for the local stock-car teams) they'd be willing to lend me a hand by actually porting the head for me, of course, I'd have to source out the valves, springs, cams, etc and assemble it in my Bro's shop, would take about two weeks once I had everything. I was quoted $300 for a pair of heads for a 350 small block, seeing our head is aluminum, and a lot more complex, I'd assume they'd charge me close to $500-$600 for a 2zz head, including all the reassembly, probably less if I install the hardware on the head myself.

the only troubles I can see, the valve seats are actually "imprinted" with a laser directly on the aluminum, I'd have to machine them out, and put new titanium or steel seats in place of the old ones. a bit of a trick, but it's doable.

The best option would be for me to locate a long-block motor, trashed or not, and build the whole thing from the get go, then, it's just a matter of swapping it in, that, or finding another celica to drop it in.

With all the shops in your area that build up Vtec motors, the toyota engines should be pretty easy for them. I know some places sell stage 2 built heads for the 2zz for about $1500 ready to install.

I think a P&P would be most effective on a 1zz motor though, and it's set-up to put out more torque once built, so, maybe that would be a better idea in retrospect.

If I can find a donor motor, I'll let you all know, regardless of what I can find, I fully intend to have a second motor built up, ready to go for when my warranty is up.

-Rave669

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celicapimp02
Member
celicapimp02 Jun 16, 12:48am - #21270 

Member
2002 Toyota Celica

Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 398
i have a motor if you wanna buy it
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